Welcome to Australia's only Vintage Radio and Television discussion forums. You are not logged in. Please log in below, apply for an account or retrieve your password.
Australian Vintage Radio Forums
  Home  ·  About Us  ·  Discussion Forums  ·  Glossary  ·  Outside Links  ·  Policies  ·  Services Directory  ·  Safety Warnings  ·  Tutorials

Special Projects

Forum home - Go back to Special Projects

 Civic Radiogram chassis with BSR Monarch turntable-Unknown model and valve layout.edited.
« Back · 1 · 2 · Next »
 Return to top of page · Post #: 1 · Written at 8:33:37 PM on 2 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

Hiya Folks.
Turns out with assistance from here,its not a Mullard after all.It just uses their Valves.
I have a 5 Valve chassis was brought out to Australia in a radiogram.
The cabinet was thrown out years ago.It looks similar to a tabletop Westminster A263M radiogram made by Belcher Ltd of London.The same cabinet only possibly.

Stupidly,I packed the valves in tissue when moving house, and the markings came off, and lost the cardboard identifying card. I have done the 'breath and hair oil' thing. Didnt seem to work.

Works, but is a bit low.

I had an older Aussie bloke radio serviceman put the valves in the right order-took him a couple of hours.

He said he was unable to align the radio.I dont know why. He did replace one cap that had a short. He did at least,get it going.

The Radio has mw.sw.lw.gram-one of the valves is a EBF89. The Plessey capacitor says Oct/60.

I have trawled through 100s of pictures on the net for quite some time.

The output transformer was also replaced by an older TV tech about 18 years ago.

I am constantly amazed at the knowledge of valve radio people.

Maker-Possibly E.A.R (Electric Audio Reproducers)

from radio museum- Name: Stone, J & M, Emston, Emstonette; London (GB)
Abbreviation: stone
Products: Model types
Summary:
J & M Stone Ltd.; 66 Upper Richmond Road, London

J & M Stone used brand names Emston, & Emstonette. They may have commissioned other manufacturers such as Champion to manufacture their radios.

Quote from Radio Radio page 166, regarding J & M Stone
"While many individual retailers carried on with single premises, the post-war years saw a great expansion of retail chains with firms like J & M Stone. (fig 273)and Civic Radio Services, who merged in the mid 1950's into a chain of over 100 Branches spread throughout the country."

History:
Quoted from UKVRR,
"J & M Stone Ltd, was a TV and radio retailer with multiple outlets (in 1950, they had 64 shops and Max Stone was the MD – the “J” was John Stone). It was established circa 1929. They acquired Civic Radio Services Ltd, of Birmingham. Around 1960, all branches were converted to trade as “Civic”.
Emston and Emstonette was a brand used by J & M Stone Ltd, 66 Upper Richmond Road, London, SW15 (in the 1950s). I think the “Em” stood for Max and the “ston” came from Stone."

This manufacturer was suggested by Mike Edwards.

Mullard Radiogram Chassis
Mullard Radiogram Chassis
Mullard Radiogram Chassis
Mullard Radiogram Chassis


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 2 · Written at 9:51:50 PM on 2 April 2016.
Robbbert's avatar
 Location: Hill Top, NSW
 Member since 18 September 2015
 Member #: 1801
 Postcount: 2012

I think this could be a good radio if the puzzles could be worked out.

There's clearly a 6AV6 there (EBC91), the one next to it I would swear is a 6M5, but coming from Europe it can't be. Next to that is clearly another pentode. The valve between the IF cans is obviously the IF amp, and there's another valve hiding under the antenna rod. I'm guessing the IF amp is your EBF89, while the other may be a ECH81.

At the right of the bottom picture is possibly a 6V4 (EZ80), but I can't see it in the radio.

The ferrite rod appears to be broken, which would cause a lack of sensitivity on the AM MW band.

I can't imagine how it could take hours to sort out a few valves, maybe it was more complex than what I would have thought.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 3 · Written at 10:16:23 PM on 2 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

So, it's 6 valves not 5?


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 4 · Written at 11:05:44 PM on 2 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

Hi GTC/Robbbert.The radio serviceman gave me that one on the right he hasn't been well. I didn't want to press him too much. some advice off a nice chap in the UK he said the word 'Hornbrook' top left of bandspread glass (obscured) might mean the Radiogramme might have been made for a shop. I did Google the name, it came up as a shop in Yorkshire. The former owner Jim did come from Yorkshire. Thanks for your help and kindness. It's a 5 valve set.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 5 · Written at 11:36:51 PM on 2 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

I figured it was likely UK Mullard by the references to Midland, Wales, Scottish, Ireland, etc, on the dial.

On that basis, vintage radio collectors in the UK may recognise it. I'll post the dial photo on a UK forum and see if it attracts any bites.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 6 · Written at 12:27:34 AM on 3 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

Thanks GTC. Robbbert. There's a number on one of the bigger valves it says- 3F1/1798 at the top.
I have since glued the rod back together. It did pick up Radio China International on Shortwave the other night with about 5 foot of wire.I also have a tin roof in this house.

Also very vaguely, I remember the turntable being on the left in the cabinet. I'm guessing the Radio was on the right and facing 'out'. I even asked the Ex about it, but she doesnt remember. Sorry that's all I can remember.

I have emailed Brad to see if he can upload a picture of the underneath.

Mullard Radiogram Chassis


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 7 · Written at 9:01:04 PM on 3 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

A good photo of the under chassis would be useful.

BTW: Why do you think it is a Mullard unit?


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 8 · Written at 10:17:07 PM on 3 April 2016.
Robbbert's avatar
 Location: Hill Top, NSW
 Member since 18 September 2015
 Member #: 1801
 Postcount: 2012

Looking at the underside, the rectifier socket can be seen, yet there is an unknown pentode plugged in there. It's the socket on the right, close to the transformer, with the 2 yellow parallel wires.

Unfortunately that orange capacitor is obscuring some pins, making it difficult to be 100% sure of what I'm seeing.

Honestly I'd be plugging in that spare 6V4 just about now.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 9 · Written at 10:26:35 PM on 3 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

It had a cardboard card that I thought had a Civic model number on it. Thanks.

I think this is it. I dont know how it became a Mullard.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Civic-Radiogram-Valve-Amplifier-Monarch-Turntable...

Thank you for your all your help.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 10 · Written at 8:41:43 AM on 4 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

I was just about to say that the UK people are not convinced that it's a Mullard or Philips set.

How did you find that eBay ad?


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 11 · Written at 9:53:28 AM on 4 April 2016.
MonochromeTV's avatar
 Location: Melbourne, VIC
 Member since 20 September 2011
 Member #: 1009
 Postcount: 1182

I too was wondering about it being a Mullard.

From looking at the eBay ad and the U.K. Forums it seems you have there a generic/home brand radio chassis.

As there is already some discussions on the UK forums about the Civic Monarch, and along with GTC's query on the same UK site we might be able to nail it.

The other thing that concerns me about the chassis is the power supply. It looks like you had a output valve (6M5 or 6BQ5) where the rectifier (6V4/EZ80) should go.

At first I wasn't sure whether it had a push pull output & a solid state rectifier.

As for identifying the valves, if they are Mullard or Miniwatt types, they will have the factory codes in tiny letters near the base. These tiny factory codes do not rub off too easily.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 12 · Written at 1:54:25 PM on 4 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

Hi lads,
I emailed a man in the UK who raised the possibility of a generic shop unit.I never thought of that
before.
When I saw this unit on ebay.I thought it was vaguely familiar.It seems this has lost its cardboard
identifying card as well.
The serviceman who did look at it recently replaced the underside capacitor,added a new
bulb and gave me another Valve.


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 13 · Written at 3:37:19 PM on 4 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

Two possibilities from the UK forum:

"Civic was a chain store brand, Currys I think"

or:

"H. A. Stone, the Department Stores chain"


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 14 · Written at 4:04:06 PM on 4 April 2016.
GTC's avatar
 GTC
 Location: Sydney, NSW
 Member since 28 January 2011
 Member #: 823
 Postcount: 6686

From the eBay photos I can see that one valve is marked EL84 (an audio output pentode).


 
 Return to top of page · Post #: 15 · Written at 8:19:57 PM on 4 April 2016.
Marty's Gravatar
 Location: Butler, WA
 Member since 2 April 2016
 Member #: 1899
 Postcount: 9

Thanks for the tips.I.m silently cursing I didnt write all that stuff down years ago.I can probably start getting some Valves for it now.I will try to have a look around the case of the valves for factory markings.
I do remember Currys as shops.


 
« Back · 1 · 2 · Next »
 You need to be a member to post comments on this forum.

Sign In

Username:
Password:
 Keep me logged in.
Do not tick box on a computer with public access.