Well I have the radio back up and running, On the bench now listening with an ipod as source plugged into the back

I have replaced most of the caps apart from a couple of .005μF of which I could not obtain value today....

I have been unable to receive any radio, I am really not sure how much you pick up on these things now days?

But anyway, it sounds ok at low volumes but seems to distort pretty quickly increasing volume...I am wondering if that 50μF cap had been there to give it a little more oomph....I may even wack it back in just to see what happens...

I have the original Rola speaker running...all valves seem to be running nice and cool...transformer also cool...its drawing about 30watt

No bites...The radio sounds great as it is...been feeding it with some Ella Fitzgerald, very happy so far...That 40μF 450v cap will go to good use else where...

Edit I missed your last 2 posts

Use 0.0047 μF 630 volts if you got any...personally I'd dump any old eletro just not worth the hassle ok for testing things if its alright but I wouldn't personally use it long term...but thats me....oh and for long term us even thought they cost heaps get quality electros at lest for the PSU caps.

good to know its working but yeah AM without a proper Ant can be the pits...and these days with so much crap out there it dont help (thought were you are if close to the city I would have thought OK).

I'll leave this to others to comment as they are much more informed then me but an alignment is probably in order.

Dont touch those IF coils if you dont know how and I'd wait for advise on that...damage them and it wont be good.

Cheer: Laurie


G'day Laurie,

I dont know your level of familiarity with Valve Radios and really I am a Noob here so more hesitant to post as I'll probably put my foot in my mouth.

But just on the Transformer and I haven't looked at the schematic...the Bee's I have come with ones that had an electrostatic shield, this goes to earth.

The other thing I have found out is that the heater winding, one side is taken to chassis, that being use as the return wire effectively Kriesler seemed to do this a lot all the bee and plums I have are done that way and so are the nippers..so it seems to be the done thing for heaters in radios unlike guitar amps.

Thought others can clarify that one.

lastly Yes Valve schematics aren't very logical in the flow idea of "Between rails" so you really need to look whats going were...

Dont know about this one but another catch or trap for the unwary is "Back Bias".

The Idea of getting a crude negative voltage supply for a valve.

Seems to be more so done by take an electro from B+ to the CT (Centre Tap) of the transformer and then a resistor to ground... the junction of this (cap neg, resistor & CT will be a negative voltage with respect to earth)...the CT and negative float so dont make the mistake that they should be grounded (and I hope I got that right)

Anyway I'll see if I can find a schematic to eye ball or wait for Mono to post it up.

Yes as pointed out above you will find variations in the circuits and sometimes many of them the Bees have like 40 different versions...then add in later work which seems to have been done in yours ...oh what fun

PS nice restore of the Cab was that your handy work...gee I like your like your reference measure a beer bottle cause we all know how tall they are

Not much help I know but Just trying to save you a little heart ache here maybe in the future.

Good luck mate.

Here are the 11-9 Service Sheets.

Kriesler 11-9 Service Manual

You'll find the only difference from the 11-7 is the speaker part no.

It also appears the 11-10, 11-11, 11-12 & 11-13 radiograms use the same chassis & circuit, but with an extra switch for radio/gram.

Looking at the circuits for the 11-9 & 11-9 issue 2, both use 2 X 16μF 525 volt electros & 2 X 25μF 40 volt electros. I cant see any 50μF caps anywhere in the circuit.

Also which output valve does your 11-9 use? Is it a 6V6GT or EL33?

I am getting the feeling that you have left out one of three electrolytics. This should have been picked up from the parts list, especially as it has had a refit, prior to this.

One of the original caps was a double, containing the cathode bypass for the 6V6 (C43B) 25μF 25V; C43A & C43B are the two filter caps. The modern C43B should be an RB type so that it can (with air) be mounted from pin 8 to chassis.

Also note that when changing caps that you should check resistors. R4, R86, R8, the R14A's; R145B are all ones that I regularly find out of spec. If C48B is missing you will get low B+ volts and it does not go to chassis. Make sure R148 has not been removed, or is shorted out.

I had a Philips recently where some clown had put in metal jacketed caps in the same configuration as that, wrapped wire around them & soldered it to the chassis. That shorted out the backbias voltage across the resistor (in your case R148) and the set will never run properly if you do that.

Marc

Thanks for replies, I should say that valve stuff is new to me, I have deliberately tried to steer clear of it as I do understand its a whole other world to solid state of which I have been trying to focus my learning on the past couple of years...

...Was a huge amount of work stripping that cabinet back Dj I tell ya...lost count of hours and still a long way to go...needs to be sanded back one more time to get the perfect finish...I am using polyurethane...love hate relationship with the stuff...

(The modern C43B should be an RB type) excuse me Mark what does RB mean?

Both of those 25 μF 40v caps have been replaced with 22μF 63 volt cheapo jaycar electrolytics, but I might put some decent ones in now....

And yes you guys are right, there was a 16μF cap left out and I did notice this on the parts list but for the life of me I could not see it on the schematic...This morning of course its looking right at me......

After chasing the circuit through again, The 50μF cap that was removed was in place of where the 16 should have been...(C42A)

also as you may have noticed the other 16μF cap is only rated a 500v, should be 525v and the 50 μF only rated a 450v, should be 525v....

My radio uses the 6V6GT Monochrome...

Anyway I have refitted the 50μF presuming that who ever put it in there knew what he was doing...Lets hope!! and retested Sounding better again.

In regards to these resistors, is there a different colour code for these? as I cant make sense of the markings...if need be I will chase everyone back through the circuit but its a bit of a head ache...


Well now I am happy that its working and sounding good...I might choose to strip the choke off and clean it up properly...as well as the cover plate for the transformer...

also need to put a fuse in it, I am thinking a 2 amp fuse will do the job?....

This will be used pretty well much all the time with an ipod once finished...So any suggestions of mods I can do would be great....

I am also going to need to change dial glass lamps...are these available?

HI Laurie

Actually I meant to comment on the Electros....with Valves unlike Silicon Diodes were you can with in reason get away with going higher, its best advised Dont over rate the capacitance unless you know the rectifier valve and the design of the PSU...there is a little latitude...but best to ask if in doubt and ideally if you dont know stick to whats there originally (meaning as per manufacture's schematic)

Thought I'll leave it to others to comment on that ...it was point that monochrome Made that reminded me I should have mention that but in my noob status Id rather not comment too much as I dont like to give out miss information

Thanks Monochrome for the circuit...

my comment on quality was in regard more so to PSU caps as they are the work horse and the ones that will cop a beating and punishment

thought you can buy cheap high voltage electros that work its a higher risk game of a failure I suppose & a comment from Marc that he has seen them fail in 2 Years

Side point
with computer VRM's of around the 2K period there were a lot of failures due to as legend has it a stolen formula...that said you need to replace with Low ESR (Effective Series Resistance) types of quality...now you can replace with cheaper ones but what would happen is the circuit demands would kill them in a much shorter time ...so I guess that what applies above if you use something of quality it will last longer then something that will do the job but fail in a shorter order..
it becomes a personal choice I suppose

BTW just cause its there dont assume they knew what they are doing ...I have nipper with a large cap that if anything might have damaged the Rectifier 6X4

I am going to fit a NOS one when I rebuild that puppy

Marc has posted here that these days you dont see a Surge Voltage Rating on Caps along with Working Voltage like you use to so best advise is if its a 5Y3 rectifier go with 500V rated caps with the 6X5 rectifier Valve I believe you can get away with 450 V but personally I err to a higher voltage ...again me using dyna bolts to put up a small shelf I guess but as I said they are the caps most likely to take punishment

Edit... Since 525V were originally fitted Id use 500V myself anyway to be safer...again my choice if it was me

The 6X5 rectifier tube is one that you will find horror stories on in the US thought it seems not so much here... still they arent what you call a power house tube either 70 mA (not that they need to be)

Again my personal thought is any of them should be tested before putting back in Circuit
They can and do suffer H K leakage (heater Cathode) which with the design of the circuit can result in a bad failure.....when the HK shorts

I do think they are probably somewhat the victim of bad press in some regards
which more applied to the original 6X5 and perhaps the abuse of them by some radio manufactures

Still there are quite a few variations in the GT range that leads me to think there was enough concern that redesigns were done ...thought that could relate to patents too...no one likes getting sued

Thought I haven't properly fix up and re-calibrated the Valve tester I have every used 6X5 I had did show leakage...thought there is a finite point you can get away with it till

But again thats my Noob thoughts on it... I'll leave it to others for theirs as they would know far better then me

if you really want to research it go over to "Antique Radio Forums" there a few threads there

Another Id personally advise is a fuse at lest on the mains side, thought I dont see a lot of comment on that..its not 100% protection but better then none in my eyes...again others my offer there opinion as they know better then me

Transformers now come with thermal fuses but in those days they didn't and Brad can relate one horror story of failed old eletro's and cooking transformers (and why I think the best place for old electro is in a bin along with any wax jobs)

Evatco have lots of the goodies you need for working with Valves..thought as I said the better quality caps do cost an arm and a leg

http://evatco.com.au/.

Seem yes this thing has "Back Bias" as mention above by Marc...thought I think he meant C4"2"B ? along with R148 resistor (35 ohm)

RB Style I think he means out of the same end (not axial but pcb style) is it a tight fit were it goes?
Anyway I'll let Marc answer that one

I dont know much on restoring wood cabinets but I think it looks very good and can imagine it was a lot of work...I love the look myself

Oh selective blindness lol yes I've had that...or you catch it in the corner of eye but cant find it...
when you look

The 6V6 GT and EL 33 will have I believe different Bias voltages so you'll find the circuit different
but other changes may exist and sometimes knowing the Valve can pin point which diagram to use and changes to look for...thought I am not sure of the purpose why mono asked that

OK must away things to do

Cheers all

You will see RB types from Jaycar etc. The leads come out of the base and being a fraction of the size of the older ones, can be as said, be mounted on the valve socket but keep a bit of wire length to keep the heat away. Use highest temp type.

With 6X5 rectifier you can use a lower voltage filter cap as there is not the same surge on start up as a 5Y3. Circuit & transformer will be different also. Stay with Capacitor values: Too big will strip the cathode of the valve.

Plenty of chopping & changing went on with wartime production. 6V6 & EL33 are not the same and the bias of EL33 is around half that of a 6V6. So there will be a circuit change to the cathode resistor.

Marc

Apologies guys I will come back to this...I've had some car troubles and have had to put this project aside for now...
Thanks for your replies though

No worries Laurie your radio thought is probably easier to fix then a modern car...
good luck with it thought

Things automotive have changed, but not always for the better. A couple of locals had the same model series Ford & at abt 200,000Km they all self destructed from the same cause. Apparently most cars now days have to have the head bolts replaced at around that time.

I have two engines in service and my brother one that are over fifty & still have the original head studs? One of those engines has worn out three sets of rings the other two that we know of. The other is still a first life block & pistons.

Its when the computers go wrong that you are really in the poo, especially if they are un-procurable.

And as for above, I took the metal car in to the dealers to book in the plastic one for service. A mechanic was eying it. My immediate thought was that "you are not getting your hands on this, it has points and has to have the distributor set mechanically, you won't know how to do that; It has grease nipples, no matter what the nipples are on, you will not know how to handle them: Then if there is something wrong, there is no computer diagnostic port, so you have to know the fault, thus you are doomed".

Marc

Then if there is something wrong, there is no computer diagnostic port, so you have to know the fault, thus you are doomed".

The independents may all be doomed soon anyway:

"Independent mechanics and new car owners are caught in the middle of a stand-off between two key automotive industry bodies - the Federal Chamber of Automotive Industries (FCAI) and the Australian Automobile Association (AAA)."

"The FCAI, which represents car makers, and the Australian Automobile Dealers Association (AADA), which represents new car dealers, sparked upset when the two groups announced a new code of conduct that covers the latest developments in new car maintenance."

"That angered the AAA, which represents Australia's motoring clubs, and the Australian Motor Industry Federation (AMIF), which is the peak body for new car dealership and independent workshops, which claim the new code effectively cuts out independent operators by withholding crucial information about new car safety and environmental information."

Read more: http://www.drive.com.au/motor-news/feud-rages-over-car-warranty-repairs-20141022-119a48.html.

Head bolts on modern cars are tensioned in a three step sequence and then tensioned a specified number of degrees which actually stretches the bolts which remain under tension. It supposedly saves on manufacturing costs as robots can do it uniformly. These bolts should definitely not be reused and it seems that the Ford bolts lost their tension.

These bolts should definitely not be reused and it seems that the Ford bolts lost their tension.

So to the wheelnuts on a Ford.

On a more serious note though, the motor industry has been trying to close itself off from the world for a long time. Part of the fallout of the closure of Australian factories there are about to be BIG changes and not many of these will be well received by the people.

For a start, the demise of local manufacture completely wipes out the genuine consumer-class large car market segment that Holden and Ford have dominated for decades. There are no replacements coming for these cars. Huge interior combined with rear wheel drive and a large six or eight cylinder engine. This segment is gone and that's all there is to it. The next category down is that dominated by Toyota's locally manufactured Camry and Aurion. Reasonably large cars but front wheel drive and no V8 option. Okay if you have a family of four but not okay for towing that tri-axle Millard home away from home.

Then to the subject of servicing. Ever changed the brake pads on a Mercedes made in the last few years? You can't. It has to be done by a mechanic because only they have the laptop with the software to instruct the car to automatically bleed the lines and then retract the pistons in the brake calipers. The days of the home handyman squeezing the pistons back into the calipers with a G-clamp and then bleeding the lines manually are just about over.

If you change a head gasket on a modern car with an aluminium engine block and strip the thread holding in one of the head bolts you can pretty much expect to replace the engine for all the help you will get from the manufacturer. Then there is the perception that the Commodore and Falcon need to compete with the S-class Mercedes and 7-series BMW. Features like speech recognition, GPS navigation and self-parking on base model cars is not necessary. I'd also be happy to go without airbags, ESP (electronic stability protection) and seat belt tensioners. All these things cost money and should be available to those who want them but for those that don't it is just a cost burden. Although the latter are now mandatory for new registrations so the new world order has really got us all by the crown jewels.

There's more hardship to come. Once Holden, Ford and Toyota have left town (in the manufacturing sense) the motor industry is just going to do as it pleases. Prices will rise, after sales service quality will probably taper off and we'll be beholden to the various brands as they form the same types of cartels that grip us in other industries. Four banks control the nation's wealth. Two supermarket chains control about 80% of the retail sector. Two media empires control the majority of the nation's television broadcasting and newspaper publishing. One company controls most of the nation's casinos and has a heavy influence in its only competitor.

The sad thing is, that some of the independent mechanics are better tradesmen than those at dealer service departments. If they aren't around it'll just be another erosion of the nation's skill base.

Okay if you have a family of four but not okay for towing that tri-axle Millard home away from home.

Most of the caravans I see these days are towed by a 4x4 which is a cheap buy compared to a regular sedan thanks to the "cow cockie" discount. Increasingly, I see Winebagos replacing the towed van.

some of the independent mechanics are better tradesmen than those at dealer service departments

That's for sure. I've been taking my cars to the same fellow for more than 20 years. I know him well and I know that he won't rip me off and will phone me if there's a problem that needs parts before proceeding.

In my experience, dealer service shops (aka stealerships) are staffed in the main by "apprentices". I put that in quotes because none that I've seen stay there long so I have to assume that they have quit because it's all too hard and their mates get better money doing nothing for the dole.